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	<title>Comments on: In the Guardian: Death in Libya, betrayal in the West</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/2009/05/15/in-the-guardian-death-in-libya-betrayal-in-the-west/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/2009/05/15/in-the-guardian-death-in-libya-betrayal-in-the-west/</link>
	<description>Investigative journalist, author, filmmaker and Guantanamo expert</description>
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		<title>By: Cape Verde Property</title>
		<link>http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/2009/05/15/in-the-guardian-death-in-libya-betrayal-in-the-west/comment-page-1/#comment-55021</link>
		<dc:creator>Cape Verde Property</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Feb 2010 18:41:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/?p=2905#comment-55021</guid>
		<description>Truly shameful - Bush, Blair, Cheney, Rumsfeld - How will they be depicted in 100 years? I know how they should be. Since when did imprisoning 700+ people without charge or trial for so many years demonstrate the claims for democracy. It just proves the &quot;do as I say, not as I do&quot; mentality and has set back the world 50 years in my opinion.
Like previous comments say, &quot;why is this evidence so toothless? Why aren&#039;t prosecutions pending?&quot;
Truly shameful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Truly shameful &#8211; Bush, Blair, Cheney, Rumsfeld &#8211; How will they be depicted in 100 years? I know how they should be. Since when did imprisoning 700+ people without charge or trial for so many years demonstrate the claims for democracy. It just proves the &#8220;do as I say, not as I do&#8221; mentality and has set back the world 50 years in my opinion.<br />
Like previous comments say, &#8220;why is this evidence so toothless? Why aren&#8217;t prosecutions pending?&#8221;<br />
Truly shameful.</p>
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		<title>By: Torture Whitewash: How “Professional Misconduct” Became “Poor Judgment” in the OPR Report &#171; freedetainees.org</title>
		<link>http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/2009/05/15/in-the-guardian-death-in-libya-betrayal-in-the-west/comment-page-1/#comment-55009</link>
		<dc:creator>Torture Whitewash: How “Professional Misconduct” Became “Poor Judgment” in the OPR Report &#171; freedetainees.org</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Feb 2010 01:55:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/?p=2905#comment-55009</guid>
		<description>[...] al-Libi’s “Suicide”, Lawrence Wilkerson Nails Cheney On Use Of Torture To Invade Iraq, In the Guardian: Death in Libya, betrayal by the West (in the Guardian here), Lawrence Wilkerson Nails Cheney’s Iraq Lies Again (And Rumsfeld And The [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] al-Libi’s “Suicide”, Lawrence Wilkerson Nails Cheney On Use Of Torture To Invade Iraq, In the Guardian: Death in Libya, betrayal by the West (in the Guardian here), Lawrence Wilkerson Nails Cheney’s Iraq Lies Again (And Rumsfeld And The [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Andy Worthington</title>
		<link>http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/2009/05/15/in-the-guardian-death-in-libya-betrayal-in-the-west/comment-page-1/#comment-38011</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Worthington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 23:43:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/?p=2905#comment-38011</guid>
		<description>This from the Talking Dog:

It&#039;s been several days now, and, near as I can tell, this is still not all that big a story here (other than as part of what Wilkerson is doing viz Cheney), and let&#039;s face it: it&#039;s not going to be.  Have we reached the point where we can &quot;move on from the Iraq thing and the Bush thing and the torture thing, and let&#039;s worry about health care and the economy...&quot; a/k/a the John Kerry 2004 electoral strategy...?

I don&#039;t know... It looks like &quot;pragmatism&quot; is the order of the day, until there is enough of an outcry to change it... but this will take an awful lot.  Even this story has been dutifully hijacked for the usual partisan purposes by the usual corporate sources, hence the focus on what Pelosi knew, as if she were herself carrying out the torture, or wasn&#039;t threatened with summary arrest by Bush if she said anything, or of course, even if she were actually told anything!  But there you are: everything is reduced to a shouting match, and nothing is actual reporting, let alone context, although note, they won&#039;t, for example, set up a shouting match with Pan Am 103 and Lockerbie families, because, well, that wouldn&#039;t serve corporate interests...

Well...  keep on getting this out there...  we&#039;ve now reached the point where the MSM is now behaving as compilers from &quot;the real news sources&quot;... which ain&#039;t them.  Amazing... Well, go get &#039; em!

And here’s TD’s take on it all:
http://thetalkingdog.com/archives2/001305.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This from the Talking Dog:</p>
<p>It&#8217;s been several days now, and, near as I can tell, this is still not all that big a story here (other than as part of what Wilkerson is doing viz Cheney), and let&#8217;s face it: it&#8217;s not going to be.  Have we reached the point where we can &#8220;move on from the Iraq thing and the Bush thing and the torture thing, and let&#8217;s worry about health care and the economy&#8230;&#8221; a/k/a the John Kerry 2004 electoral strategy&#8230;?</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know&#8230; It looks like &#8220;pragmatism&#8221; is the order of the day, until there is enough of an outcry to change it&#8230; but this will take an awful lot.  Even this story has been dutifully hijacked for the usual partisan purposes by the usual corporate sources, hence the focus on what Pelosi knew, as if she were herself carrying out the torture, or wasn&#8217;t threatened with summary arrest by Bush if she said anything, or of course, even if she were actually told anything!  But there you are: everything is reduced to a shouting match, and nothing is actual reporting, let alone context, although note, they won&#8217;t, for example, set up a shouting match with Pan Am 103 and Lockerbie families, because, well, that wouldn&#8217;t serve corporate interests&#8230;</p>
<p>Well&#8230;  keep on getting this out there&#8230;  we&#8217;ve now reached the point where the MSM is now behaving as compilers from &#8220;the real news sources&#8221;&#8230; which ain&#8217;t them.  Amazing&#8230; Well, go get &#8216; em!</p>
<p>And here’s TD’s take on it all:<br />
<a href="http://thetalkingdog.com/archives2/001305.html" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/thetalkingdog.com/archives2/001305.html?referer=');">http://thetalkingdog.com/archives2/001305.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Andy Worthington</title>
		<link>http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/2009/05/15/in-the-guardian-death-in-libya-betrayal-in-the-west/comment-page-1/#comment-38010</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Worthington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 23:41:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/?p=2905#comment-38010</guid>
		<description>This from Jason Leopold of the ever-investigative The Public Record:
http://www.pubrecord.org/

Andy,

This is truly an outstanding article and your coverage this week has been superb. You, yes you, single- handedly kept this story alive and ensured that we know the truth. 

I am none too happy with Obama&#039;s decisions as of late. Releasing the documents was a good move but what good does it do to release evidence of war crimes if you&#039;re not going to do anything about it? We need serious criminal investigations. 

Best,
Jason</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This from Jason Leopold of the ever-investigative The Public Record:<br />
<a href="http://www.pubrecord.org/" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/www.pubrecord.org/?referer=');">http://www.pubrecord.org/</a></p>
<p>Andy,</p>
<p>This is truly an outstanding article and your coverage this week has been superb. You, yes you, single- handedly kept this story alive and ensured that we know the truth. </p>
<p>I am none too happy with Obama&#8217;s decisions as of late. Releasing the documents was a good move but what good does it do to release evidence of war crimes if you&#8217;re not going to do anything about it? We need serious criminal investigations. </p>
<p>Best,<br />
Jason</p>
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		<title>By: Connie Nash</title>
		<link>http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/2009/05/15/in-the-guardian-death-in-libya-betrayal-in-the-west/comment-page-1/#comment-37996</link>
		<dc:creator>Connie Nash</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 19:08:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/?p=2905#comment-37996</guid>
		<description>As always, Frances, your words - when not unbelievably beautiful, have a sharp way of cutting to the quick and stirring up deep reflection...

And at the same time -  what do we call the &quot;terrorists&quot; who want others&#039; resources - who control  people and nations as if they all were pawns?

Who are the international real estate lawyers or judges or juries who can find a legal name and sentence for those who confiscate lands and property as if the deeds were their own? 

What are they named who bomb to near extinction history and land as if the inheritors and all they have inherited from their earth and their ancestors were &quot;up for grabs&quot; - and the tillers and the educators of the young are forced to wander the earth - lucky if  they are fortunate to escape with the shirt on their back? 

What do we call the maker&#039;s of modern empire - sculptors of metals hurling fury and leaving screams in their wake?  Who are the engineers &amp; wardens who re-invent &amp; invent anew physical and psychological traps of torture? Who are these among us - lauded for courage &amp; skill - who  imprison with neither the mitigation of fact or findings nor the light of law?  

Who are the ones who run about with our national sanction and yet who hold regard neither for rights nor freedom nor any other sacred trust?  

How do we describe those who disregard promises made (whether international, to another nations, to &quot;hired&quot; fighters or to fellow humans who&#039;ve been &quot;trashed&quot;?)

How do we name the inhumane qualities that are more contagious in our time than any swine flu - which make out of the life of the single prisoner hell on earth? 

Something other than fighters for freedom, eh?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As always, Frances, your words &#8211; when not unbelievably beautiful, have a sharp way of cutting to the quick and stirring up deep reflection&#8230;</p>
<p>And at the same time &#8211;  what do we call the &#8220;terrorists&#8221; who want others&#8217; resources &#8211; who control  people and nations as if they all were pawns?</p>
<p>Who are the international real estate lawyers or judges or juries who can find a legal name and sentence for those who confiscate lands and property as if the deeds were their own? </p>
<p>What are they named who bomb to near extinction history and land as if the inheritors and all they have inherited from their earth and their ancestors were &#8220;up for grabs&#8221; &#8211; and the tillers and the educators of the young are forced to wander the earth &#8211; lucky if  they are fortunate to escape with the shirt on their back? </p>
<p>What do we call the maker&#8217;s of modern empire &#8211; sculptors of metals hurling fury and leaving screams in their wake?  Who are the engineers &amp; wardens who re-invent &amp; invent anew physical and psychological traps of torture? Who are these among us &#8211; lauded for courage &amp; skill &#8211; who  imprison with neither the mitigation of fact or findings nor the light of law?  </p>
<p>Who are the ones who run about with our national sanction and yet who hold regard neither for rights nor freedom nor any other sacred trust?  </p>
<p>How do we describe those who disregard promises made (whether international, to another nations, to &#8220;hired&#8221; fighters or to fellow humans who&#8217;ve been &#8220;trashed&#8221;?)</p>
<p>How do we name the inhumane qualities that are more contagious in our time than any swine flu &#8211; which make out of the life of the single prisoner hell on earth? </p>
<p>Something other than fighters for freedom, eh?</p>
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		<title>By: Frances Madeson</title>
		<link>http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/2009/05/15/in-the-guardian-death-in-libya-betrayal-in-the-west/comment-page-1/#comment-37988</link>
		<dc:creator>Frances Madeson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 14:04:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.andyworthington.co.uk/?p=2905#comment-37988</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s always been a freedom fighter in every terrorist; and equally, a terrorist in every freedom fighter. What you call it  depends on where you stand, what glasses you have on, and what you need.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s always been a freedom fighter in every terrorist; and equally, a terrorist in every freedom fighter. What you call it  depends on where you stand, what glasses you have on, and what you need.</p>
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